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#151
hunebedbouwer

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^^^^^^^^^^^^

Nice to hear you're really enjoying yourself Harvest  :P

 

I will watch that final tomorrow and  :good:  :good:  :good: for the Finnish team.

 

What level are the top European ice-hockey leagues compared to the NHL? Always thought the German, Finnish and Swedish (even the Swiss) were good with pretty decent salaries and attendances.


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 ´dance me to your beauty with a burning violin, 

  lift me like an olive branch and be my homeward dove,

  raise a tent of shelter now, though every thread is torn,

  we're both of us beneath our love, we're both of us above, dance me till the end of love´


#152
Harvest

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^^^^^^^^^^^^

Nice to hear you're really enjoying yourself Harvest  :P

 

I will watch that final tomorrow and  :good:  :good:  :good: for the Finnish team.

 

 

Finland-Russia. 20:30 in Finnish time (not sure if  the Netherlands are in the same timezone, though)The Russians managed to beat the USA after all in the other semifinal. Well, it's nice to set the record straight after that preliminary round loss :dwarf:

 

 

 

What level are the top European ice-hockey leagues compared to the NHL? Always thought the German, Finish and Swedish (even the Swiss) were good with pretty decent salaries and attendances.

 

They can't compete with salaries. The minimum wage for an NHL-player is about 550 000 dollars. For example, the top players in Finnish league earn about 300 000 euros, but the median income is around 80 000 per year. The top NHL-players, like for example Patrick Kane earn 10,5 million per season. This is a quite handy page for NHL-salaries (click "players" for player comparison, team log for wages/team) . There is a hard salary cap for every team nowadays and no player can earn more than 20% of that cap. Here is some info about the NHL Collective Bargaining Agreement

 

Goaltenders Pekka Rinne and Tuukka Rask are top Finnish earners with their annual 7 million dollar incomes. For example, top Finnish team IFK Helsinki pays 3 million euros in wages combined this season.

 

In Europe, the Swiss League and Russian's Kontinental Hockey League are the wealthiest. The Russian salaries aren't open to public, but they say some players earn as much as the NHL -stars. Don't know what the average income is though. Here is some attendance stats (ongoing season) from Swedish Eliteserien and Finnish Liiga (KA means average/game) compared to NHL.  The Swiss NLA is about 5000-6000, the exceptions being Zurich Lions (about 9500) and SC Bern (16 000). Not sure about the wages in German League, but attendance stats here.


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#153
hunebedbouwer

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Hahaha, what a madhouse those last two minutes! I really thought the Finns had the cup inthe bag after the 3-2. (it's overtime now)

 

I think the first period was better from the Russians, not only feistier, but also so much better in their powerplays. Lots of hard shots and a couple of goals, while the Finns only managed a shot on the post. Period 1 Finland 45% - Russia 55%.

 

Then that overwhelming second period with lots of powerplay for Finland, but still no goals! A lot more shots the first two, but again, the last two almost no real danger. But such a frantic and pressing game of the home team. Man, if you compare this match to the battle for bronze: that was such a boring match. The Swedes were nowhere! Also twice, during powerplay for Finland, two Russian breaks with a one on one with the Finnish keeper!

Period 2: Finland 70 % - Russia 30%.

 

The third period was a bit messy from both teams, but when the Finns were allowed some space, they could play their smoother style of playing. And the Russians got a lot of penalties.!!!! I really thought Finland had won the game at 3-2, but what a delicious mayhem in those last two minutes! Then my Russian stream fell away and when I got another it was overtime. Period 3: Finland 55% - Russia 45 %.

 

And then WHAM BAM THANK YOU MAM.......4-3 with the most beautiful goal of the match!!!!! :dwarf: Because it was such a fast, energetic and  hectic game, I really got sucked into the match! Better than many Olympic matches I've seen :good:  In the end, a well deserved win for the Finns, although I feared for them after the 0-1 and seeing that strong Russian defence.

 

Congratulations to you Harvest (and all Finns) :ok: and have a nice drink on me! :drinks:  

 

 

P.S. Was surprised to read those Swiss attendances by the way. 


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 ´dance me to your beauty with a burning violin, 

  lift me like an olive branch and be my homeward dove,

  raise a tent of shelter now, though every thread is torn,

  we're both of us beneath our love, we're both of us above, dance me till the end of love´


#154
Harvest

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@Thanks, Hunebedbouwer,

 

I think I'm going to faint now :laugh: . Here's to victory :drinks:

 

Some trivia, btw. Finland under 20-year olds have won their three latest Championships (Russians in -98, Swedes in 2014 and now Russians again) by scoring the golden goal on overtime. So why change a good tradition :) .

 

Kasperi Kapanen was on a road of being our biggest culprit. He missed an open net on powerplay and because of his poor play the russians tied the game. But he managed to get his act together on a right moment. Our "Junior-trio" also woke up on a right time. Two goals for these future stars. I agree with your assesments, the Finns should have scored a few goals in the second. Puljujärvi, Aho and Laine are very gifted young players, but they did some very bad mistakes and played very poorly on the powerplay today. Well, that's how you learn. By doing mistakes. On the other hand they scored two goals again. 

 

The Finns were trailing in most of there games in this tournament. Kind of a good learning curve for them. They didn't panic, even when they were trailing the Canadians, Swedes and Russians, which in many cases in our history has been our main weakness. These guys just don't know how to lose, it seems. 

 

Future looks very bright for Finnish Ice Hockey now. Two WJC-wins in the last three years and bunch of Finnish young players are making headlines in North-America. There are also more great prospects coming and our coaches are top notch. Jalonen will continue to KHL after this, but another very good Finnish coach Jukka Rautakorpi will continue his work. The adult team will be coached by young, very talented Lauri Marjamäki in the future. All of these guys are deticated to a kind of "total icehockey"-type of tactics. 

 

Over a million Finns followed every game of this tournament. So this was a big victory for Finnish sports. 


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#155
hunebedbouwer

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Top Gear and wintersports. Always a highly enjoyable combination I would say. Jeremy Clarkson however........ :giggle:

 

 

 

 

 


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 ´dance me to your beauty with a burning violin, 

  lift me like an olive branch and be my homeward dove,

  raise a tent of shelter now, though every thread is torn,

  we're both of us beneath our love, we're both of us above, dance me till the end of love´


#156
hunebedbouwer

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Okay you Finns. Here's the following question:

 

Although I'm not really a fan of motorsports, the interest for Formula 1 has exploded in the NL, because of Max Verstappen. Since you Finns always seem to have 1 or 2 drivers present, is there any change he might beat Kimi Raikonen or Valttheri Bottas this year for points total?

 

This was last year's result:

 

Raikonen (Ferrari) - 150 points

Bottas (Williams Mercedes) - 136 points

Verstappen (Tororosso Renault) - 49 points 

 

My own prediction is that Verstappen will improve his points total considerably (because of an improved and more powerful Renault motor) and that he will beat Bottas, but not Raikonen. What do you think? 


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 ´dance me to your beauty with a burning violin, 

  lift me like an olive branch and be my homeward dove,

  raise a tent of shelter now, though every thread is torn,

  we're both of us beneath our love, we're both of us above, dance me till the end of love´


#157
whitenoise

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It's difficult to say before the season starts. It's not only the engine but there are a lot of things that affect eg. gear box durability, tyre durability and behaviour, fuel consumption, straight-line speed, corner speed, performance in hot temperatures, driveability, tactics, driver's nerves etc. Its appeal is its unpredictability.
 


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#158
hunebedbouwer

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I always thought the appeal lay in the first corner.........but then I like a bit of action...... :P

 

 

 

 

 


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 ´dance me to your beauty with a burning violin, 

  lift me like an olive branch and be my homeward dove,

  raise a tent of shelter now, though every thread is torn,

  we're both of us beneath our love, we're both of us above, dance me till the end of love´


#159
whitenoise

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But we are tree cutting people and F1 cars are too fragile tools.






 


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#160
hunebedbouwer

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Are there a lot of Finns with suicidal thoughts?

I mean, you can argue if motorsports are really sports (along with snooker, darts, curling, bowling, cricket, etc. etc.) and it's okay that that people want to drive that fast and dangerous over those kind of roads, but WHY sit next to the road and stand especially in sharp corners to watch? I assume to see cars crash and to be there first hand. Utterly ridiculous and I personally have no empathy when rally cars do occasionally kill those sensationalistic spectators. It sound harsh, but in some way they are looking for trouble....I just can't understand it!

 

Tell me Whitenoise, why do they do it?   

To me it feels like trying to catch a javelin

 

4974957.jpg


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 ´dance me to your beauty with a burning violin, 

  lift me like an olive branch and be my homeward dove,

  raise a tent of shelter now, though every thread is torn,

  we're both of us beneath our love, we're both of us above, dance me till the end of love´


#161
whitenoise

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Standing at the outer side of the corner is prohibited if there is no high bank but standing at the inner side is generally allowed and not dangerous. Prohibited viewing zones are usually marked. Several zero cars run through the route before the superstage can begin (cars with yellow lights on the roof shown on the last video in my previous post). If people are not standing in the right positions, marshals in the zero cars order them to move. Even the whole superstage can be cancelled due to a few people who insist on standing in the wrong place. You can bet the other spectators are not showing gratitude to those idiots in that case. Additionally, there are (mostly voluntary) staff who are blowing into a whistle whenever a car is coming and are also overseeing that spectators keep their positions. That's what it is in Finland at least. I don't know how other rallies elsewhere in the world are organized. If someone dies due to one's own stupidity, it's a law of nature, I guess. Stupidity is punished. Last time a spectator died in Rally Finland was in 1996. It wasn't the spectator's fault, though.

I don't care much if someone is saying that motorsport isn't sports. There are also people who are saying that metal music isn't music. Anyway, it requires good skills of handling the car, much concentration and good nerves and that you really want to win.

Here's a video of the extremely fast super stage called Ouninpohja, perhaps the most legendary in the whole world series, seen by an onboard camera of Kris Meeke's car. It's a scary and very demanding 34 km long superstage but drivers love it. See how the crowd is at inner side of the corners and men in yellow vests are those who are warning of the coming cars with whistles.


 


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#162
hunebedbouwer

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@Whitenoise

 

I'm sure the Finns have very heavy rules concerning safety etc., but you know accidents will happen. It's not a question of IF, but WHEN. Like that accident in Spain last september: 6 dead people, one little child and two pregnant women amongst them, And 16 injured people with 6 very seriously. Just one of the many deadly accidents in rally driving.

 

Yes, the drivers have extraordinary skills and if people want excitement it may be for them, but personally I think it has a lot to do with living on the edge, because you know, accidents will happen. I'm talking all motorsports, even these big American trucks in an arena. We had a major acident in the NL last year with an out of control monstertruck. Three dead and 28 seriously injured people.

And what I find the most annoying thing is the outrage by people afterwards: mayor of the town was sacked, all kind of investigations are ongoing, people sueing and why? They know that anything involving motors can be dangerous. So why going and why so outraged? For me it is a possible consequence of going to these events. 'Dead by motor'-event s - Why complaining afterwards if something happens to you or your dearest'? 

 

Finland may have the heaviest regulations of them all, but still people will die there and more likely in all those countries with lesser regulations. I know the Finns love their rally's, but it's just not for me, although I do admire their skills and courage.

 

I must say though, these tumbling cars do a great job keeping those hedgerows in order! 


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 ´dance me to your beauty with a burning violin, 

  lift me like an olive branch and be my homeward dove,

  raise a tent of shelter now, though every thread is torn,

  we're both of us beneath our love, we're both of us above, dance me till the end of love´


#163
Harvest

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Finnish young ice hockey players continued their victories last night, when they beat the Swedes 6-1 in under 18-old world championship final. Someday and not in a very distant future these guys will  play adult games. And it will not be fun to play against these guys. Finland has put a lot of effort to renew our hockey from tactics to training methods to general game philosophy and that seems to pay off now. 

 

I hope the dispute between NHL and IOC would end and the NHL-players would participate the 2018 and 2022 winter olympics. If that happens Finland is going to have a hell of a team in those tournaments. 


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#164
hunebedbouwer

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@Harvest

 

Well, you don't need to worry about the Russians for a while, because they have withdrawn their whole team, due to being 100% doped on meldonium and other crap. I want Russia to be banned for the next 10 years from all sports all over the world and that includes tennis. :verymad:  :verymad:  :verymad:  They are a total disgrace to sports and civilization and more so: they spoil it for the real athletes!! What's the pleasure in getting any kind of medal so many years after you performed in a sport when you think you have been beating fair and square by another athlete or that you almost certainly know you've been beaten by dopeheads while performing? :bad:

 

There's so much cheating and doping AND corrupt checking on doping going on, it's hard to trust anyone anymore and you start to mistrust any decent/good/fantastic performance. In other words: it's very hard to really enjoy most sports. Goodness me, there are also plenty of countries who cheat and are using doping in the paralympic sports......for what exactly? So you can say: "we are the best in the world in disabled volleyball!!!!". while cheating by using abled volleyballers? (Iran/Spain). Wow, what a great wonderful, honourable feeling that must be!!!! :bad:  :bad:

My advice: once caught, give them a ban for life and a hefty fine depending on what sport. The more you can earn, the bigger the fine! Is it common in one country, ban the country for a painful period, let's say 2-4 years. Caught twice, ban them for even longer periods with big fines.

And for goodness sake, stop all these changes in nationalities. They are mercenaries (99%) and do it just for money. All these Africans that are bought by Arab states so they can buy medals, because they are too lazy, stupid or whatever to sport themselves. Also, quite a few European countries do it with Abeba Aregawi (Ethiopia-Sweden) being one of the most blatant examples. And now it turns out, she's doped to her rafters as well. :yucky:

 

One of the few athletes I still really enjoy is our Dafne Schippers, but even as I think she doesn't do doping, I would not put my hand in the fire for any athlete anymore, certainly not when money is involved. It's really sad that it all had to come to this. I can't think of any Italian major cyclist who has not been caught doping the last twenty years and the saddest thing is that some (like di Luca) imbeciles has no regrets whatsoever to deprive other and better cyclists from glory, honourable mentions, history and yes, money. 

      

 

Anyway, Dafne Schippers, our Dutch athletic hope since last year, has opened her outdoor season with a 22.25 on the 200m in very wet and windy conditions in Gainesville, USA. Last year she opened with 22.63 while still performing heptathlon till May. I am so very curious and a bit exited if she's going to run even better times than last year, especially while concentrating on sprinting solely this olympic year. And she made our 4x100 relay also a lot better! 


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 ´dance me to your beauty with a burning violin, 

  lift me like an olive branch and be my homeward dove,

  raise a tent of shelter now, though every thread is torn,

  we're both of us beneath our love, we're both of us above, dance me till the end of love´


#165
Harvest

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@Hunebedbouwer,

 

That's the name of the game, unfortunately. Athletes have been cheating since ancient Greeks in some level. What ever it takes to win, I guess. I'm not that sure , for example, ice hockey players are clean. They play 100 games/season. It's only fair to assume that doping is involved in some level. At least there are bunch of players who have given unofficial raports on the heavy use of doping in the NHL, but not surprisingly they have been silenced pretty quickly. 

 

Adult World Championships approaching. They start in a week and I'm starting to have a really good feeling about them. Mikko Koivu, Alexander Barkov jr, Mikael Granlund, Patrik Laine, Sebastian Aho, Teemu Pulkkinen, Leo Komarov, Jussi Jokinen, Ville Pokka. The Finns are going to have a very good team this year. Granlund and Pulkkinen in the same team again. They were one dynamic duo in their junior days. Koivu and Barkov our top centers. 

 

Actually we haven't had this kind of hockey team in a while on international level. Let's see what happens.


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#166
Harvest

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There's a quarterfinal-stage beginning in Ice Hockey World Championships and Finland is going to play against the Danes. So far, the Finns have played an impressive tournament. 7 games, 7 wins with 29-6 goal difference, and they beat USA and Canada in the preliminary round. Especially the way they tamed Canada's NHL-stars with the 4-0 victory was impressive. As usual the Finns seem to have a great team with no I in it. 

 

But. I don't want to underestimate the Danes a bit. The Danish ice hockey has been improving for the last decade or so and they have Nikolaj Ehlers, a player who will be their first NHL-star in the future, on board. Together with Nicklas Jensen, another promising player, the two have played a very impressive tournament so far. The Finns have to keep an eye on these two. 

 

If the Finns manage to beat the Danes, they will go against the winner of Russia-Germany game. So the odds are quite favorable for a Finns-Russia semifinal in Moscow. Now that would be a treat.


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#167
hunebedbouwer

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@Harvest

 

So the final is Finland against Canada! Just caught that news on the media, because ice-hockey at the end of May is for me a bit like eating strawberries in January, totally out of season. Other (summer) sports do get much more attention and broadcasting ice-hockey in the NL is like growing tulips on the Northpole:

non-existent. :music:

I am watching the final at the moment and shouting for the Fins. If they win, it must be one of their best years ever!

 

 

Meanwhile the Dutch do live a bit on sportcloud nine with: Max Verstappen winning his first grand prix, the swimmers reaching their top form for Rio, Steven Kruiswijk in the pink jersey in the Giro d'Italia and Dafne Schippers just running 22.02 in horrible weather here in the Netherlands.

Also our female volleyballers qualified for Rio

 

 

One thing I can't understand how Van Gaal underperformed at Manchester United! He must have lost his mojo, because as a football lover his tactics were just awful and resulted in pretty boring play. No matter what, I would never ever replace him with the Disgusting One aka Mourinho, because not only will his football be defensive, cowardish and dirty, but I just can't stand his disgusting behaviour and the always blame-someone-else-attitude. I think and hope it's a recipe for disaster. :music:  Really, Van Gaal should be replaced, but anyone but that Portugese creep.

 

 

P.S.  I am sorry guys, Canada just won. :negative:   


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 ´dance me to your beauty with a burning violin, 

  lift me like an olive branch and be my homeward dove,

  raise a tent of shelter now, though every thread is torn,

  we're both of us beneath our love, we're both of us above, dance me till the end of love´


#168
whitenoise

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Is football summer or winter sport?


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#169
Harvest

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P.S.  I am sorry guys, Canada just won. :negative:   

 

Yes, Finland could have made history. No country has ever won under 18, under 20 and adult World Championships in the same season. But Canada was just better team, period. They played better game and Finnish defence was in trouble the whole 60 minutes. Finnish goalie did everything he could, but you can't win with zero goals. 

 

On the other hand, we haven't heard the last of guys like Sebastian Aho and Patrik Laine. These guys are our next generation of big ice hockey stars. 

 

Now, football european championships next.


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#170
hunebedbouwer

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@Whitenoise

 

Football is an almost  whole-year-around-sport and the only wintersport the English are good at. :P


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 ´dance me to your beauty with a burning violin, 

  lift me like an olive branch and be my homeward dove,

  raise a tent of shelter now, though every thread is torn,

  we're both of us beneath our love, we're both of us above, dance me till the end of love´


#171
whitenoise

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I see. We don't have as stable conditions.

This is what we have...

In winter


In summer

 


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#172
hunebedbouwer

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@Whitenoise

 

Amazing what the Fins come up with to have a good 'footballing' time whatever the weather conditions. :good:

Over here we can't even manage to play decent normal football the last few years! :teehee: NL not present at the European Championships this summer!! And that with even 24 countries qualifying. Total humiliation really. :negative:

 

Our most practiced form of football in winter is indoor-football. Which is nice, comfortable, but nowhere near as fun as snow football!!! And ofcourse the totally overrated professional players all go to (sub)-tropical destinations to rest from their exhausting profession. :D  


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 ´dance me to your beauty with a burning violin, 

  lift me like an olive branch and be my homeward dove,

  raise a tent of shelter now, though every thread is torn,

  we're both of us beneath our love, we're both of us above, dance me till the end of love´


#173
Serious Sam

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I have a question, are world champions really the best teams in the world? Considering how international the best leagues are? What I mean is, in league teams players who can't play in national teams can play together. And the league teams have way more practice playing together than the national teams. Some teams are just stacked with the best national team players of several countries. THW Kiel in the German handball league is just an all-star collection of great players from all around the world. That's something a national team can never be. 

 

On a side note, if anyone is watching NBA, what do you think about the upcoming season? Do you think Warriors for the title is a wrap?


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Imaginations from the other side" ~Blind Guardian, Imaginations from the other side


#174
whitenoise

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From the Olympics thread:

@Whitenoise

* I'm very curious about Finnish baseball. Does it involve smashing up animals or something or is it a real sport?

Oh yes, a real sport. It's not even supposed to hurt spectators with a ball. This would be whistled as a foul ball:



In Finnish baseball, hitting the ball over the field is not a home run because there is a foul line at the back of the field. There is no fence or grandstands around the outfield. A ball that hits the ground within the boundaries and bounces off the field is still in play. This means that a player can't be jogging after a successful strike like that on the video. It makes the game faster.

The ball is delivered as a vertical pitch and therefore hitting the ball is relatively easy. It gives a player more control on the ball and there are very few strikeouts, which again makes the game faster and more tactical. Placing the ball so that fielders can't anticipate is important instead of hitting the ball as far as you can.

 

The field looks like this:

AR-AK256_FINBAL_9U_20150709100315.jpg

 

The running distances are longer than in American baseball.

 

 


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#175
Harvest

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@Hunebedbouwer, 

 

Yes, hockey is next on my list and it's going to be a long season. Things start with World Cup in september 17th. That's the other big tournament with all the best players alongside Olympics. Don't really like how the tournament is set up this time, beside the normal teams (Canada, USA, Russia, Sweden, Chech Rpublic and Finland), they also made Team Europe (biggest stars from Denmark, Germany,Slovakia etc.) and Team North America (means N-american stars 23 years and under). Sure now we really have every star in that tournament, but adding teams like that feels a bit fake. 

 

Next stop U-20 World Chapionships in Canada. Finland is a defending champion and we will have another very talented group in this tournament. The style will be more defensive this time, our headcouch Jukka Rautakorpi is traditionally for more defensive game. Under 18-team won a world championship as well and some of these guys are now taking their steps forward. And of course, even if the U20-team biggest stars (Jesse Puljujärvi, Patrik Laine and Olli Juolevi) all ready singned NHL-contract, they are still eligible to play in that tournament. Depends what their NHL-team wants to do with them. 

 

The team I support, HPK Hämeenlinna, has had a rough few seasons. Both, the economy and success, have dived. Now it seems we are getting back on track. They issued shares last season and that went relatively well. The team managed to sign one of Finland's top coach prospects, Antti Pennanen. He is a very promising young coach, who kind of reminds me of Jukka Jalonen. Pennanen believs in offensive tactics and puckcontrol and that's the HPK-trademark. And Niko Kapanen, probably the best player to ever come out from HPK, returned home. Years of playing in NHL, Finnish national team and KHL, this guy is still going strong. HPK has already sold more seasontickets and it seems like we are going for better future. It doesn't happen over night of couse and there are still big questionmarks, but the first time since Jukka Jalonen left the team ten years ago, I feel optimistic when the season is starting. 

 

So lot's to follow in coming months.


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